competition hunts

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Jerrod Douglas
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Postby Jerrod Douglas » Thu Dec 09, 2010 12:26 pm

James Guy wrote:
Jerrod Douglas wrote:CHOICES.

I know there are some places and things we must go and do. We MUST GO to work. We MUST GO to the grocery store. We MUST GO pay our bills, etc. And I do believe people can have certain things, like pleasure hunting,etc., that they can have fun in. Now if you are not trying your best to walk with God any of this shouldn't pertain to you. But if you are then why in the world would you want to set your heart to believe that you can participate in COMPETITIVE sports and not be tempted. If you say you don't get tempted by a COMPETITIVE spirit to want to win than that is hard for me to believe. Like I said before it is the nature of this FLESH to want to win, prove your dog can win a placement,etc. If you are doing it for just you and your hound then what in the world do you have to prove to just you and your hound. I mean, you have been pleasure hunting that thing all week and you already know every move it is capable of and its coon treeing ability. Bottom line, a competition hunt is a place where the spirit of COMPETITION will be working in you. If you don't think so then why would you go? Some at these hunts want to win more than others I know but EVERY person there wants to win or they would have never loaded their old hound up. The temptation of the sins that are sure to be in competition starts in the decision whether to go or not to go to a competition of any kind. God could care less about who wins the WORLD HUNT or who wins the SUPER BOWL. No way. So why in the world should any of his children try and win something or cheer for a certain team that we want to win?


Why is it wrong to want to win a competition? I know of no scripture or biblical principle that would forbid this. Unless you do it in a way that is sinful (cheating, lying, sinful pride, etc.).
Being proud of winning, of your dog, etc. is not the same as sinful pride that puffs up as long as you are THANKFUL for the win, your dog, etc.


You are simply making provisions for the flesh if you go. If you think you are not then you are only fooling yourself. There are men that CLAIM they don't have any problems with lusting after women and drinking beer. And the truth is they REALLY DON'T. The same man that don't have these problems goes to a bar and sits his self down in there. He is saying he don't have these problems and don't at the time. But, you know what? He IS MAKING PROVISIONS FOR HIS FLESH! He knew what was there before he left the house. Yes, this strong man never intended to do anything wrong but he just simply made provisions for his flesh by allowing his mind to tell him he was strong and went to a place where temptation will sure be there. So is the same with a man that says he don't have a problem with competition hunts. He may not at the time but he simply is making provisions for his flesh. There are too many situations that will arise for temptation not to be there for the one that says things at these hunts don't bother him and he don't have a problem with them.

A man dont have a problem with a woman, that does not attracted him at all. But if you leave him with her alone long enough he will begin to have thoughts and one thing may lead to another....

In (a child of GODS) life I know that there is simply temptation that comes. He said it would be but we set ourselves up sometimes by simply making provisions for the flesh. If competition isn't making provisions for the flesh then a strong spiritual man going to a whore house isn't making provisions for his flesh. I mean strong man don't have problems with women but he will if he stays there very long. They are different sins and different situations but it all works the same. We just recognize the bigger sins easier. Its the ones that look little to us that are going to be deadly if we ain't careful. So if you don't want to make provisions for the flesh then don't.
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Jerrod Douglas
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Postby Jerrod Douglas » Thu Dec 09, 2010 12:51 pm

By the way, the good man that went to the bar didn't just go to go but he liked to play pool. There is no sin in playing pool but it is just the atmosphere where he brought THE TEMPLE OF THE HOLY GHOST. He should have bought a pool table and played at home or with some of his good friends. Even invite someone that needed God where he could be a witness to them there instead of where he had made provisions for his flesh.
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Austin Alford

Postby Austin Alford » Thu Dec 09, 2010 8:11 pm

You dont even know how many I have witness to in a bar do you. Who do you think need it more. The man I a bar or the man next to you in church they both need to prayer but at least the man in the bar can see a christian can have fun with out partaking in sinful activitys who are you to judge. I hope we are learning for each other and not making this a fuss and looking at each others views cause that wouldnt be christian like would it. Dont write the man off at the bar cause he has a soul to remember him when you pray. Cause i was that man once

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Postby Jerrod Douglas » Thu Dec 09, 2010 8:49 pm

I have prayed several people through and helped bring them to Christ that ran the bar life. But I didn't do it at the bar. I did it at their house and mine. A bar wouldnt be a safe place to do it because it makes provisions for the flesh. I judge no one and have judged no one. But if a man truely is after GODS heart he wont find it in the bar. It is too risky for a mans soul to put his self in the bar to be a witness. Is it or is it not making provisions for the flesh to be there? Its a biblical rule. Not a man made rule.

Also I have some people I call my friends and also my mother that runs the bars. That is all I knew and me myself was delivered from that lifestyle of sin. Why would I want to down anybody like this. It was me. Its my mother. Its my some of my friends. I witness to some of them. And am getting somewhere with them. If I decide to go to the bar and do it some of them are going to think something is bad wrong if they see me there. I may try and be a witness there but what am I putting before my eyes? What kind of atmosphere will I be in?

A group of people had a discussion one day with Jesus. They were christians. They didn't want to pay taxes to the pagan government because the government was against Gods rules. They asked Jesus since the government was wrong and against GOD why and did they have to pay their taxes because they were christians. They didn't want to support paganism. At least they thought Jesus would say not to pay taxes because of who would be getting their money. Jesus simply asked them to look on the money and tell Me what it says. They did and said it says Ceasar. He said give unto Ceaser what is Ceasars because it has his name on it. But he didn't stop right there. He also said to render to God what belongs to God. He was emphasizing to them to give all of themselves to God because that is what God commands. We are not our own but we are bought with a price. THE BOOK SAYS. I and no one else ever got ready and went to a bar to give ALL of themselves to God. Much less a little bit of themselves. My mom and my old friends may be at the bar right now but they all can and will confirm and admit to what I am saying.
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Postby Jerrod Douglas » Thu Dec 09, 2010 8:54 pm

I ain't sending no one to hell but if we will stay away from certain places our soul will be further from hell. If we go to certain places our soul will be closer to hell. Simply for the provisions to our flesh we make by bringing ourselves to these places. We are ALL subject to fall in these places. They are no place for A CHILD OF THE KING.

EVERYTHING I have said on this entire post is not popular but it is the Truth.
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Austin Alford

Postby Austin Alford » Fri Dec 10, 2010 7:12 am

So should I stop going to work, sporting games, walmart; guess I need to stay at home and just go to church and wait for them to come to my house or church to testify to them. Might also need to quit paying taxes cause our goverment dont look to God fearing to me.Do you sin or do you think your sin is any better than the man at the bar. Last time I checked they where all equal, but blastfeming against God.I think we should both pray for God to watch over us and for him to send us in the right direction.Ever where we go in this world is full of sin. Everyone in the churh will not make it into the kingdom.

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Postby Jerrod Douglas » Fri Dec 10, 2010 8:47 am

Like I said, there are places we have to go. There are things we must do. There are also places we should stay away from, if we are trying to live for GOD. The ones that didn't want to pay their taxes thought they had Jesus that day. They knew they were supposed to pay taxes but thought that he would say not to because of the governments paganism. These people , if you read this passage of scripture, were trying to do all they could get away with but still live for GOD. He answered their question about the taxes. He said to give unto Ceased that which is Ceasars. But he added to give unto God that which is Gods. Gods commandment is to give ALL. Myself, my mom, my friends, you, or anybody else is not giving our all if we bring ourselves to places like that.

You were right. Everyone in the church will not make it. I will add this, no one out of the church will make it. If that's judging then then so is the first statement I just made here which I quoted from you.

If a man waits at his house to try to be a witness then he ain't going to get much accomplished.

MAKE NO PROVISIONS FOR THE FLESH. You are making them bringing yourselves to certain places. Bottom line. If you weren't then we wouldn't need this and a lot of other scriptures. We all sin a.d come short of the glory of God. But God gives us wisdom through his word. Are we making or not making provisions for OUR flesh in these places???
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Austin Alford

Postby Austin Alford » Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:29 pm

Mr Jerrod do you own Insane X may seam of topic?

Jerrod Douglas
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Postby Jerrod Douglas » Fri Dec 10, 2010 7:26 pm

Mr Austin, yes I do own him. Im sure you already know that and know where you are going. Incase you haven't read all my posts I have been studying this topic and didn't see the potential danger it has on a mans soul due to the fact of lack of knowledge of the Word until I studied and continue to. The book gives clear direction to keep ourselves as far from the traps of sin and the traps of satan. The scriptures that I give sure does go against it. I like competion hunts as much as anyone but see the danger, not only for my soul but yours and others also, of the what WE call small sins to take root in us. I am for everyone on here and everyone else. And I hope everyone else is the same towards me but if not I am still going to believe the word of God and His commandments.

Hey James, ain't heard from you today. I asked you what you thought about this topic on the phone the other day and asked you to put on here what you thought. I admire a man to stand up to what he believes in. Thank you for posting. I aslo have another question, I know you have been keeping close tabs on this post and am curious why you haven't put your input in on wether or not it is ok for the bar to be a safe place for a Child of the King to hang out and even "witness" there? I am very curious of your input on this subject. Let's be totally honest with each other all on here and everywhere else and agree that if the Word requires of us to be something and also requires of us to make NO provisions for the flesh and that if one of us are saying one thing and then through the word of God see that we may be wrong be CHRISTian enough to admit our wrong doings and sayings and go forth living for Him. I will admire a man for that even much more.

Like I said I am seeing the dangers for everyone including myself of sin in certain things. And if we want to make no provisions for our flesh then the first step would have to be don't bring it to a place that we have a choice to go or not to go if it is temptation there. Yeah I know, what tempts some people may not tempt others but if put there in the right time, the right place, the right situation there will be temptation. We have a choice in so many things we do and we can either keep alot of temptation from us by not going certain places(making provisions for the flesh) or continue to go and see how super spiritual we are. The thing is these sins in the competition world hide in our hearts even from our own selves because we are raised as a child competing in sports and different things. It is set in our hearts as little children. Just because momma, daddy, grandma, and grandpa did it doesn't mean it's right. What does the word say about it.
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Austin Alford

Postby Austin Alford » Sat Dec 11, 2010 12:42 am

I thought you would see where I was going. I know its not good for us to be there and Im not there eveynight the doors are open. It has been for ever since I have been. My point is that you can go and still be a christian. In the past the reason I was there was to make sure my wife got home ok. I felt like it my job to protect her if I can I cant make her not drink but I can make sure she get home ok. I thank God that he has saved her and I no long have to be there cause temptation is tough. A young marriage to hard when one is doing thier best to do right and the other isnt ready to surrender their soul to the Lord but It wouldnt be right for me to leave her either cause its till death do you part. I do see your point on somethings Im a bady christian still learning and hope it never stops. Just keep me in your prayers and Ill do the same for you for God to protect us and lead us the way we should go

Oh I really do like X I have heard alot of good things about him hope you didnt think i meant anything bad towards you or your dog God Bless

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Postby Jerrod Douglas » Sat Dec 11, 2010 2:13 am

I sure see your point for going for your wifes saftey and your peace of mind. My mother still runs the bars when she can. I LOVE my mother no matter what. My dad would go to the bars at times with her just to try to help her and keep an eye on her for saftey and also to keep men off of her. I know what you must have felt like. It was a very hard time for my dad. It got VERY bad and my dad tried all he could do to make it work other than give his life totally to God and turn the situation over to God. It resulted in divorce. It was a sad thing that the bar life destroyed. If my mother would have had the teachings that I am learning when she was a child I believe she would have had a better chance of never having the temptations and provisions for her flesh. It sure may have been a different marriage. 20 years down the drain. What a waste. If some of these biblical teachings would have been taught to her and shown to her I believe she would have saw different. After she was in the trap she tried to get out but she couldn't. I watched her cry from guilt and conviction after she was caught and she never could get out. The devil comes to steal, kill, and destroy. That is what he did. Consider yourself blessed. You owe it all to God. I already have been praying for you and will continue to do so. I do not judge no one. All I have said just are things that will prevent a lot of temptation and sin and nothing else. May the Lord richly bless you and your family.
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Austin Alford

Postby Austin Alford » Sat Dec 11, 2010 9:52 pm

He has already in more way than I can ever repay I love him deeply and wish I never fell short but I do and always will because we are not perfect. Thanks for the prayers. I hope to meet you one day and May God Bless you and your family as well.

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Re: Article on competition hunting and gambling

Postby Daryl Bales » Sun Dec 12, 2010 6:06 pm

James Guy wrote:You can also find this article at: http://redtidekennels.files.wordpress.c ... ling1.docx

Here are some things to consider. Bear with me (it is a long article) and I will explain how we might apply them to the coon hunting / gambling issue.

WHAT MAKES SOMETHING WRONG?
There are at least three ways something may be wrong (or right for that matter). (1) God says it is. That’s good enough isn’t it. (2) It is against God’s principles He set for us, or violates the principles of righteousness. (3) It violates our conscience. That is, if we believe it is wrong, that it is wrong for us to do it.

The first one is obvious. If God says something is wrong, it is. We may try to find excuses for doing it, or try to “re-interpret” the Bible to fit what we WISH God said. For example, sexual immorality is a sin (I Corinthians 6:9). The difficult part sometimes comes when we do have to determine (apply) what is sexual immorality. Usually, this means we are going to try to find a way NOT to obey God, but there are circumstances where something may not be a sin even though it may be commonly taught that it is. For example, Jesus dealt with the Pharisees often and many of His conversations were telling THEM they were wrong for telling other people something was right or wrong that God did not say. In other words, they were making the rules FROM what God did say (see Matthew 15 – especially vs. 9).

The second one is a little more difficult because it requires more of our “interpretation” and “application” of something. The matter really is of the heart more than specific rules in that if we are trying to please God, we will do something, or not do something, based on what He wants. But, we still have to figure out what He wants. For example, the Bible does not tell us it is a sin to say “Sh—“ (cuss word). Some have said it is wrong to say “shoot” because it is a substitute for that word. These are rules man makes. But, God DID give us principles such as “letting your speech be seasoned with salt” and setting a good example for others, etc. There is also the principle that I’ll discuss next that must be considered. So, there is no command against saying a particular word, but certain godly principles may lead us to determine that it is.

The third thing that would make something wrong is because we believe it is wrong but do it anyway. This one is often difficult to grasp and apply. Especially since we tend to try to force others to believe what we do. Using the above example, if I think saying a particular word is wrong, I expect ever other Christian to believe that as well. This makes us the standard of righteousness and not God. No preacher, church, or anybody else has to right to decide for everybody else what is right or wrong in matters of opinion or conscience. That is what this really is. Some would suggest that this should not be a standard for right or wrong, but the Bible itself does teach us this. For example, Romans 14 (see especially verses 1-10. In this case, Paul uses the example of some who may believe it is wrong to eat meat, while others believe it is alright. He also uses the example of some who believe they should celebrate special days, while others may believe differently. The TRUTH is that it was NOT wrong to eat meat, nor to celebrate special days. But, if you did it believing it was wrong (not of faith), then you are being rebellious and violating your conscience in a way that says, “I don’t care if God thinks it is wrong, I’m going to do it anyway.” Another example is in I Corinthians 8:1-13. Here, the principle is much more clear. Some believed it was wrong to eat meat that was sacrificed to idols. Others just see it as meat. Paul clearly says that it was NOT wrong to eat the meat because it is just meat, and the idols are not real gods anyway (see verse 4 and following). He goes on to say what WOULD make it a sin is to do it in the presence of a Christian who did think it was wrong, and so influence him to eat something he thought was wrong. In this case, it was not wrong for EITHER of them to eat the meat, but it was wrong for the “weaker brother” to eat the meat because he THOUGHT it was wrong.

HOW DOES THIS APPLY TO COON HUNTING?
There are also at least three questions that must be answered concerning if competition hunting where money is involved is a gambling and/or a sin. (1) Is gambling a sin? (2) Is competition hunting gambling? (3) Is there something that could make competition hunting wrong for me, even if it is not wrong itself?

First, there is no scripture that says gambling is wrong. Many preachers and churches have made hard and fast rules against it and told people it is wrong PERIOD! But, the truth is, God does not say that it is wrong. In fact, Judas’s replacement was chosen by “drawing lots” (not for money, and led by God, but still a type of gambling). However, we must apply the other principles where it may be wrong. Does it violate your conscience, but you do it anyway? Are there other principles that may be involved that would make it wrong? For example, I know some who go to the casinos and say they do it just for fun in the same way they would go to the movies. The fact that they may be able to win some money makes it more fun for them. Who am I to say they are not just doing it for fun? But, if they do it from a heart of greed, pride, selfishness, etc. then it would make it wrong. If they believe it is wrong, but do it anyway, that violates the passages discussed above. Then, we could not say gambling itself was wrong, but why and how we practiced it was wrong. Another example of this is giving to the poor. We would not say giving the poor is a bad thing. In fact, we would say it is good. But, Jesus taught to do it for your own glory WAS wrong (Matthew 6:1-2). The fact that somebody does it in a wrong way does not make the act wrong. It is only wrong for that person to do it in the wrong way. The same is true of hunting. We know God never says, “Thou shalt not competition hunt for prize money.” You won’t find that anywhere in the Bible. But, if we do it in a way that is for greed, ungodly pride, cheating, etc. then the WAY we do it or the REASON we do it would be wrong. There is nothing wrong with wanting to win a competition. But, if you cheat to win, or tear other people down when you win, those violate other principles. It is not a specific scripture that makes gambling, hunting, or giving a sin. But, there may be PRINCIPLES that would make pretty much anything a sin done in the wrong way or for the wrong reasons.

Second, is the often asked question as to whether or not competition hunting for money is gambling. The same has been asked for many years about other things such as investing in the stock market. If we decide that gambling itself is not wrong (except when violating some principle), then this question does not even matter. If it is not wrong to gamble, then it does not matter if competition hunting is gambling or not. But, we must ask the question because some do believe gambling is wrong (even if it is because of other principles). The answer depends on how you define gambling. Again, the Bible does not define it for us, and does not say it is right or wrong. So, we would have to ask, “WHAT is gambling and WHY is gambling wrong” (if we believe it is). Then we have to ask, “Is competition hunting for prizes or money wrong for the same reasons?” There are some differences in the two though. What we typically call gambling involves MORE chance, while competition hunting (as well as sports and other things) involves more EARNING / PARTICIPATING in the winning. That said, there is some strategy to gambling, and there is some chance to hunting (the chance you draw a cast with worse dogs or handlers than you for example). The same is true of investing in the stock market. You have to strategically choose your investments and manage them wisely, but there is also the uncontrollable chance they will lose money. Of course, you “take a chance” when you buy a car….you don’t know if it will break down or not. Life is full of “chance” decisions and actions. That does not make them wrong. I do not see competition (even for prizes, trophies, or money) as the same as gambling. The reason is they are done differently, for different reasons, with a different purpose, and because games of chance and games of competition are different in their nature. But, if you do believe it is wrong, then you should not do it (based on the principles of conscience) unless and until you learn that it is not. Again, this is the same principle as the eating meat sacrificed to idols.

The third question is probably the most important one in our sport though. Let us assume that we decide that gambling is not wrong, or that at least competition hunting is not gambling and is, therefore, not wrong. We have all seen things happen in the woods that ARE wrong. Does that make the hunt wrong? No. It makes those actions wrong. Just as giving to the poor for the wrong reasons does not make giving wrong. The pride of giving for the wrong reason IS still wrong. That does not mean we should not give. It means we must be careful of our own heart and actions that we give RIGHT. In hunting, we must be very careful not to do something that is right (or o.k.) in a way that we do wrong things while doing it. If competition hunting (even for prizes) is not wrong, but we cheat somebody else to get the prize, then it is the CHEATING, not the hunting, that is wrong. If we develop a greedy heart so that we take advantage of others, or just think pridefully of ourselves, then the hunting is not wrong. It is our own greed and pride that is wrong. If we have a problem with that temptation that we cannot overcome, then we may need to decide NOT to competition hunt for money. At least not until we can overcome that temptation. We would not want to do something that would cause us to sin.

THE BOTTOM LINE
What I suggest is that more Christians participate in competition hunting and set GODLY EXAMPLES in doing so. If you do believe the “prize” part of it is wrong, then give your winnings to the rest of the cast or donate it to charity. I have hunted with people that I wanted to leave in the woods (if you know what I mean). They may cheat, or just be mean spirited. I have also seen people throw a hunt, not for political / buddy reasons or to cheat, but out of kindness to bless someone else. Consider what Paul, Peter, and Jesus said about not repaying evil for evil, but repay evil with good (Romans 12:14-21; I Peter 3:9; Luke 6:27-36). There are so many ways that we, as Christians, can do GOOD in competition hunting. We can be the shining light and example of how it should be done. That will mean you will lose some hunts, often to those who do wrong. But, you may win more than a hunt in the long run. You can often be a good example when you do win. Demonstrate kindness to those who did not win, and thankfulness to God for the win. We may even win a few hunts and learn ourselves to be thankful to God for them. You may even win that sinner to Christ, or help a misguided Christian be reminded of what matters and how he should act. In ALL we do, give glory to God (Colossians 3:17), and that can make what could be a bad thing into a good thing.

So, is competition hunting, even for prizes or money, a sin? “Let each be fully convinced in his own mind” (Romans 14:5). But, do not let your own feelings, wishes, or preferences decide for you. Neither let preachers, well-meaning Christian hunters, nor any human beings decide for you. Rather, consider what God says (and does not say for that matter), and ask Him to lead you. And if you decide that it is alright to do it, do it in a way that glorifies God. I hope to see you in the woods….


Well said!! Thank you.
Daryl Bales
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Postby Jerrod Douglas » Sun Dec 12, 2010 6:39 pm

Let's just say it like James said, some people may not have trouble with things as others will. Let's say I don't have trouble with competition. But I am to be an example for others and I even bring one of my christian buddies to the hunts to have fun and be a witness. He gets to liking the hunts as I do and still have no trouble but he begins to start cheating, lieing, bragging, boasting, etc (which all of these are equal to adultry and murder in Gods eyes) . Would it have been easier to make no provisions to the flesh if I had never got involved in it and not brought him? I guarantee you it would have. And what if I bring my son to these hunts. Get him involved and this happens to him. I don't want my son, myself, you, or anyone else getting as close to the fence as you or I can. The further we keep ourselves from the fence the further we are from temptation. I like competition hunting as much as anyone but I totally understand the danger to my, my sons, my friends, and anyone elses soul. I ain't perfect. It wasn't but ONE! Have a blessed day!
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Re: competition hunts

Postby Heath Hill » Thu Aug 04, 2011 5:31 pm

Jerrod post your address. I'm working on the photos of the mission trip (681 decisions for Christ) to Nicaragua. Want to send you a cd copy!! Thanks for donating the stud fee to help with the trip!!!
P.S. Hearing good reports from Hollis Moore on pups of of x!!

Heath Hill 78796
256-412-3467
Matt: 28:19


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